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( Should have known this would get missed as a comment, so lets make a page and see if I can get some thoughts :D )
Middle aged old fart wants to start playing electric guitar. Minimal budget but I don’t want to buy absolute trash either.
How does this package look?
I’ve seen it on Amazon for about $250. Thoughts?
26 comments
1 |
b_sharp Jan 24, 2015 3:59:58pm |
Most guitars are made using CNC equipment now so the quality is pretty consistent. The Squiers are a decently made guitar and important parts link intonation and fret placement are good. They stay in tune well, or they used to, I haven’t owned one for a couple of years.
For learning that would be a good combo.
2 |
A Cranky One Jan 24, 2015 4:52:09pm |
I posted this in reply in a different thread.
re: #62 William Barnett-Lewis
Can’t speak to the quality of the gear, having never tried it or heard it. Nor do I claim to be any type of expert. However:
My Telecaster is a favorite guitar. Easier to tune and keep in tune than a Strat. Very easy to play with a light action. An inexpensive version may not have the tone of a better one, but for your purposes should be fine. If there is a music store nearby that carries Fender/Squire you might go try one to check the feel and tone. Like I said, never played a Squire telecaster so my comments are based on playing my Fender.
As far as the amp, my spouse regularly walks around the house and announces that we have “too much stuff”. I may have a small Peavey amp that I’d be willing to pass along. Brand new, never used. Would rather it go to a good home than sit unused. Already have a number of amps and really have no need for the tiny one. It’s similar to the Fender pictured. I’d part with it for no charge; it would make the spouse happy to see stuff go out the door.
The only other advice I’d offer is to consider a classical guitar. My experience is that nylon string guitars are better than electrics for new students. I believe Yamaha makes some inexpensive guitars that can sound decent and play fairly well for a beginner guitar. Also, when I need to sharpen up my playing I usually switch to an acoustic for a while; you find out quickly where you were “cheating” or being sloppy.
I find playing guitar to be a great stress reliever. Good luck!
| 3 |
A Cranky One Jan 24, 2015 4:53:58pm |
And Armory Blaine replied with:
Classic guitar is a great suggestion. Nylon strings are easier to play, the fingerboards are wider and you can play quietly easily. Crucial for beginning stages in multiple person households. I would also add to stay away from a guitar with a whammy bar. They are harder to restring and any pressure from your picking hand on the floating bridge will change the tone while you’re playing it.
| 4 |
A Cranky One Jan 24, 2015 5:19:21pm |
I should note that I have played a Squier Strat and found it to be a decent guitar. But I would prefer learning on a Tele rather than a Strat for the reasons noted above (primarily the whammy bar).
5 |
Souliren Jan 24, 2015 6:36:17pm |
I can’t comment on the hardware. ( I have a Fender Acoustic and no amplifier)
My advice to a middle aged old fart (who is probably younger than me) is to, as soon as possible, start creating music that God and you are hearing for the first time.
Learn a scale. Pick it on the guitar. (it will be boring and tedious) then look for a YouTube video of a backing track and play random notes on the scale.
Before you know it, you will be choosing the notes in advance. Later you will be listening to the music your subconscious is creating.
Yeah you have to learn chords and songs, etc. if you expect to perform at a campfire but the above exercise is worth 20% of your practice time.
| 6 |
b_sharp Jan 24, 2015 6:46:19pm |
re: #5 Souliren
I can’t comment on the hardware. ( I have a Fender Acoustic and no amplifier)
My advice to a middle aged old fart (who is probably younger than me) is to, as soon as possible, start creating music that God and you are hearing for the first time.
Learn a scale. Pick it on the guitar. (it will be boring and tedious) then look for a YouTube video of a backing track and play random notes on the scale.
Before you know it, you will be choosing the notes in advance. Later you will be listening to the music your subconscious is creating.Yeah you have to learn chords and songs, etc. if you expect to perform at a campfire but the above exercise is worth 20% of your practice time.
That’s like inventing your own ear worm.
8 |
nines09 Jan 24, 2015 6:58:02pm |
For my two cents; If you buy a cheap acoustic guitar you will never be happy past the 3rd fret. If you wish to actually have a guitar that you can learn on and get better with I would go for a Fender Made In Mexico (MIM) Tele or Strat. The Strat will have a tremolo system that will In all likely hood need to be set up properly, although you can “block” it one of two ways; 5 springs or an actual wood block. The Tele will string through the body (hard tail) and will not have a floating bridge. For my buck I would check Craigslist for a used MIM with a case. You can get a decent one for under 350. Go to Guitar Center and ask to see their MIM models. Never buy retail, and never buy a cheap guitar new. If you wrangle a deal at Guitar Center, tell them you will buy it only with a free setup. Go for #9 gauge strings. Slinkys would be nice for a beginner. If you bought that Squire, you could never get 50 bucks for it if you wanted to move up. The MIM retains some value and they make some gems. Check eBay and see their prices. A very generous gesture above from A Cranky One. Offer to pay shipping. That’s your starter amp, and now you have 300- 350 to get a DECENT axe. Now stop saying you wish you could play and get a guitar. Here’s an example of what you can find on YouTube. Just my two cents.
Video
Now start looking. Oh, and though I prefer maple fingerboards, rosewood is the choice of some. take your time and one will talk to you.
9 |
William Barnett-Lewis Jan 24, 2015 7:43:03pm |
re: #2 A Cranky One
Be happy to take the amp off your hands. My nick is blue so you can email me.
| 10 |
William Barnett-Lewis Jan 24, 2015 7:44:52pm |
Trying again on the nic being blue. It should work now.
| 11 |
William Barnett-Lewis Jan 24, 2015 7:47:12pm |
Thanks for the thoughts everyone else. I live alone so no one to bug plus I remember my punk youth so a Telecaster is far preferred to a classical guitar. The rest is great stuff to consider.
Thanks!
| 12 |
Three Chord Monty Jan 24, 2015 8:18:46pm |
I learned on a fairly inexpensive acoustic, and after doing that any electric was manageable—but the opposite is likely not true for most players. One thing people seem to be saying these days, is that with what amplifiers are capable of doing, for not a lot of money, spending a lot on the guitar when the amp is a larger factor in your sound isn’t making a lot of sense. And there are a bunch of people on YouTube authoritatively dismissing tone wood, and doing blind tests that supposedly are supporting the idea that spending a lot of money on a vintage instrument is a waste. I love the feel and sound of a vintage instrument, but the dollars involved are just ridiculous, and I’ve gotten by for a very long time with mostly inexpensive guitars. Which is to say that I’m not endorsing that position, but that it’s perhaps something of a relief that not taking out a mortgage just for a plank is actually seen as a wise move.
A few years ago I was in my summer residence and guitar-less, so I checked out a few Squiers. I leave being a vintage snob to others, for the reasons I mentioned, but there is something, to me, to seeing a name on the sticker up on the headstock—Fender, Gibson, Gretsch, Rickenbacker, whatever. Now, I know that I have instruments that are superior to some ‘name’ guitars I’ve played at times that cost a fraction, and I do my best not to bow to status, but what can I say. It is nice to see Fender instead of Squier (even though Squier’s high end, the Classic Vibe, is capable of turning out a piece of wood that’s superior to a given low-end Fender, for instance). However, there are so many lines these days—there really are too many guitars on the market, though that has driven down prices even as it’s created a confusion-inspiring glut. A new Les Paul budget model that’s actually a Gibson (as opposed to an Epiphone, Gibson’s version of Squier, a manufacturer they purchased to round out their low end offerings—though prior to Gibson’s acquisition, Epiphone was a well-known brand, and Keith Richards & John Lennon, among others, were playing their guitars in the mid-60s) for less than $500? Yes, those are out there these days. Made in America, too (though I have always liked Japanese guitars, and several people have told me Fender’s best products that are not top of the line pieces are coming out of their Mexico factory).
I am not a Strat guy, but I tooled around with a few low-end Squiers and just didn’t think I could actually work with them long-term in any capacity. The Bullets just handled like junk, and unfortunately the Affinity series wasn’t much better. The Classic Vibes are around $500 or so, but I settled on a Modified Custom Tele II for $250 that is modeled after the redesign of the Telecaster that was turned out in the early 1970s. That guitar, I could play, and it’s fine. But, to be honest, these days I have developed a deep appreciation for Yamaha instruments (as well as certain others I don’t actually own that come from well-regarded factories in Japan, primarily, but also South Korea and even Taiwan, if I recall). The name is definitely unsexy, but boy do they make some great shit. A Tele I got for $120 with 2 humbuckers is the best playing guitar I’ve ever had, period. It was beat up when I got it, but has a feel that you just shouldn’t have with something that cheap. I scored a Yamaha (Fender Jazz Bass-style) bass at a Guitar Center for $80. Not perfect, but $80? I still play it; the pickups are fantastic. But there are other options—Musician’s Friend, Rondo, and Guitar Fetish, if you’re willing to take a chance on buying an instrument you can’t try out in the store. (I have a nice Rondo SX Jazzmaster/Jaguar offset-style bass I got for $140, probably made in China but better than much that I’ve seen from there; and two guitars I got from Guitar Fetish—Earl Slick has a budget line with them, and for around $225 each I got a nice Les Paul copy as well as a LP Junior with P-90 pickups)
Up until a few years ago, I never had a practice amp I liked, and could never afford a real Fender Champ (I had a Squier Champ that was thrown away money) with tubes. But over the years the gap between the great sound a tube amp can deliver and what a transistor amp can manage has narrowed considerably, if not completely. And I stumbled onto an amazing and inexpensive practice amp, the Roland Micro Cube, which is probably around $139 or thereabouts. I have two. By far the best practice amps I’ve ever had. Love them so much I want to shout about them, because it’s the first time I’ve been able to practice with the tone I want at a low volume, and I don’t have to rely on effects boxes as it’s actually loaded with enough decent-sounding tweaks that I’m amazed it’s so cheap. That said…
If you do go the acoustic route, prepare yourself for some extra pain. Most people I know started when they were quite young, when we are seemingly more capable of forcing ourselves to learn things, pain or no pain. But hell yeah, it’s worth it. And if you’re more comfortable starting with the easier task, there’s nothing saying you can’t apply yourself on an acoustic once you gain some experience. I’m not sure I’d rule out the idea of finding something decent for not a lot of money—the market has deflated a bit all around, so I would think you could probably snag something decent to learn on at a decent price point. And there are also lots of decent electrics to be found inexpensively on eBay—a good example is the also unsexy but reportedly fairly reliable Peavey Predators.
Hope this wasn’t too confusing. You can just as easily pull the trigger on a transaction without worrying about all of this stuff. I’ve been in guitar stores more in the past year or two than I probably ever have, and while I wouldn’t say I know much, I’ve been trying to listen to as many people as I can find who do. But for me, I would stay away from the Affinity, and probably those packages in general, and find either a sturdier Squier, or a used Japanese guitar like Tokai or Samick, and definitely a Micro Cube.
| 13 |
Three Chord Monty Jan 24, 2015 8:25:20pm |
I know I probably spilled too many words, especially when you’re posting on a site owned by a guy who’s a true pro. But, what’s done is done. If there’s one thing I didn’t do that I should’ve, though, is to drop a few links, which hopefully may be helpful in some way.
Forums:
(Telecaster)
tdpri.com
Stores:
rondomusic.com
Some hobbyists view these cheap guitars as projects to modify. Elements of them could certainly be upgraded (and in most cases they will definitely require a setup, at the very least), especially if you’re going to try to perform with them, but I do think they tend to get a bit weird about it—why not just by a guitar you don’t need to change anything on. That said, I suppose you do get what you pay for, but that $140 bass from Rondo has gotten me through more gigs without any problems than I ever would’ve expected for something so cheap. Not everybody is going to have a great experience with these companies, but so far, for me, they’re pretty darned good, all things considered.
14 |
Mattand Jan 24, 2015 8:49:13pm |
Some thoughts from a long-time, not very good guitar player:
My first guitar (which I still play) was a Fender Gemini acoustic. I’d recommend learning on an acoustic. Although you have to work a little harder on your fingering, it’ll strengthen your fretting hand. Think of a baseball batter who takes practice swings with a weighted donut on his bat.
If you go with an electric as your first, an option may be these guitars available at Monoprice. They’re known for their cheap, quality computer accessories, but they’ve been branching out into other fields.
I can’t vouch for the quality, and am solely going by the reviews on Monoprice’s website. They definitely hit the sweet spot as far price.
Regarding learning: calling this a video game seems a little off-putting, but Ubisoft makes something called Rocksmith. It’s similar to Rock Band or Guitar Hero, in which you use a controller to hit notes as they fly by you on the screen.
The hook is that your controller is actually your electric guitar. You hook it up to your computer/console with a USB guitar cable. I’ve actually learned some of the easier songs fairly quickly, and discovered the mistakes I’m making on songs I thought I already knew. It’s not a substitute for an actual teacher, but it’s still pretty cool.
And learn from my mistakes: learn to tune and properly re-string your axe early on! I had mine for two years before it dawned on me to actually tune the freaking thing.
Whatever you do, keep with it. It’s a great hobby, and if I can do it, anyone can.
| 15 |
shecky Jan 24, 2015 8:56:16pm |
FWIW, this last Black Friday, I decided to find out what $39 will buy you these days.
Let me preface this by saying when I was a youngster in the early 80s, a reasonably playable guitar, acoustic or electric, seemed to start at about $200 at that time. In the years since, I’ve been pleasantly surprised whenever I pick up a low end instrument. And in that time, the cost of an instrument has dropped since I bought my first beginner guitar.
When musiciansfriend was offering their bottom end beginner steel string acoustic guitar for forty bucks, delivered, my curiosity was piqued.
I’ll be damned, it’s a pretty good, playable instrument. The only adjustment needed was less than a quarter turn of the truss rod. Neither the nut nor the saddle needed any adjustment, something exceedingly rare among guitars less than $500. Though described as a scaled down instrument, the scale length is a full 25.5”. Its body size is about the same as a classical guitar, with the neck joining the body at the 12th fret, and more unusual for a steel string, no fingerboard radius (flat fretboard). If someone is looking for a an inexpensive, playable, decent sounding acoustic, I have no hesitation recommending this instrument. Not bad for an guitar that would have cost the equivalent of about $16 in 1982. Wish I would have had that choice back then.
16 |
Velvet Elvis Jan 24, 2015 10:20:33pm |
The thing about squires is that they don’t have the best quality control. One can be great and the next one off the line can have some real problems. I’d suggest not buying online when purchasing a low-end guitar for this reason.
If you have any friends who play guitar, the best idea would be to get them to go to Guitar Center with you and pick one out.
Squires are fine if you get one without any problems. I recently picked up one of J Mascis signature Squire Jazzmasters and love it.
Hands down the best amp for a beginner is the Roland Cube. It sounds great, has a tone of options, is easily portable, and won’t break the bank.
| 17 |
William Barnett-Lewis Jan 24, 2015 10:57:47pm |
I live in the middle of the Northwoods. Music stores are hours away at best. So for me, online is really all there is.
| 19 |
A Cranky One Jan 25, 2015 9:29:38am |
As Mattland noted, keeping the guitar in tune is important, so consider picking up a tuner as well.
| 20 |
blueraven Jan 25, 2015 12:25:38pm |
| 21 |
William Barnett-Lewis Jan 25, 2015 1:05:37pm |
22 |
Amory Blaine Jan 25, 2015 2:16:47pm |
re: #21 William Barnett-Lewis
Check out Marty Schwartz’s channel on youtube. He has a ton of beginner lessons and popular songs to keep your interest.
| 23 |
Velvet Elvis Jan 25, 2015 4:37:38pm |
This is by far the best guitar lesson site on the net:
| 24 |
nines09 Jan 25, 2015 6:53:54pm |
One final lesson that I learned at a very young age. A good instrument regardless of which type it is, will save you years of wondering and reaching for what is not possible with said instrument. Me talking to myself.
| 25 |
A Cranky One Jan 25, 2015 10:58:18pm |
One of my favorite practice amps is a Roland Cube 30. Sounds good, can give you the sound you want at lower volumes and has built in effects and amp/cabinet simulation (simulates the sound of different guitar amps).
I also love my SNARK tuner. Almost immediately became my favorite tuner.
I’d sum up a lot of the advice to be: get a decent instrument to start with, so it doesn’t impede your ability to learn and will have a decent resale value if you decide to get rid of it or upgrade; always tune before playing; take advantage of some decent on-line learning programs to not only help you learn how to play but also to help you learn proper technique. It’s a pain to try to unlearn habits, proper technique helps you avoid learning any such bad habits. Find out how to tell when your strings need to be replaced and how to replace them.
And finally, practice, practice, practice!
I personally find playing guitar to be great at relieving stress. I think it’s because my brain is always doing 10 things at once, and even when I try to relax it’s churning away on other things. However, when I play guitar, I’m doing different things at different times with the fingers of both hands, plus maintaining the beat, singing lyrics, etc. Uses enough of those levels that my brain can’t churn away as it would normally. And then I can relax.
So it’s fun and good for you. Best of luck and keep us up to date with any developments.
| 26 |
William Barnett-Lewis Jan 26, 2015 4:28:59pm |
I’m looking at this guitar as the most likely right now:
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